Rivals Football - Chelsea FC - Chesterfield/Famous

Great reading your opinions below [^]

A great example of why there will always be wars and conflict. You both look to defend and counter punch your strong beliefs without actually conceding any points to the other. The longer the debate goes on the deeper and further away you become. Just an observation and certainly not a slur on either of you.

A debate way beyond my understanding with my simple chain of thought. All I see is innocent people getting murdered and mass fallout over divided opinions. I look to my government to steer us but they're always found wanting. I don't want to light a candle, sing a song, hold continuous 60 second silences, chuck money into a fund, walk on a march, listen to continual praise of the emergency services, buy a charity record, watch a concert etc...I want peace and good will to all but that is an ideal mankind is incapable of as we greedily look for power and wealth.

Sitting in the works canteen a few years ago on the night shift I looked around at all the tired faces. One table full of Poles, another Brits, another Asians etc. We will never truly mix were my thoughts.

I'm old enough and wise enough to know peace will never be...have to find my own world for that. I feel for people like Walter who take on the woes of the world and he can't help but feel deep pain when horror strikes. He doesn't appear to take a side in anger...he just feels all the sorrow of needless death and destruction. I don't look to be led by political leaders, church leaders etc...I'm led by the humanity found in people like Walter. Yes, I praise Walter highly because he is a yardstick for us all. Sadly the world is bogged down by politics, religion, greed and power - all of which divide. United we stand? Don't make me laugh!!!

edited 20/06, 08:58 922 views

wise words.

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the gist of it being Famous supports Islamic fundamentalist terrorism, especially if Jose says so

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The gist of everything is that none of us like what's happening but when debate is had as to how we deal with it all the finger pointing starts and the whole issue falls into muddy water.

Famous is very caring man who focusses on the whole picture as he sees it. He will stand beside the little girl murdered at a concert and a man murdered in a North London street. Too many celebrate the killing of an innocent muslim man just as too many celebrated murder of young and old innocent people at a concert.

There's murder happening...in fighting doesn't help, tit for tat murders certainly doesn't help, falling out with mates doesn't help...the whole thing is a complete mess.

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[^]
Extreme division is ultimately what extremists want

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people kill each other, always have, always will

we could do with losing a few more IMO, way too many people on the planet getting in the way

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Quite...and no amount of talking will end that.

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edited 22/06, 20:45 853 views

Once again, I feel you’re looking at things in a very simplified manner.
I work in an office full of every creed and colour you can think of, without any division in who gets along with who and there’s no evidence that anyone hangs around with others based on their nationality/religion/colour, in the centre of a city where millions of folk from all sorts of backgrounds get on well without killing or hurting each other.

1) Does that mean that human nature isn’t to gravitate towards those you identify with most? No, that is quite normal.
2) Am I suggesting there aren’t pockets of communities where there is a desire not to mix with the wider community at large? Absolutely not, and that has always been the case even going back to Irish and Commonwealth immigration. But again, we are talking about a minority within a minority.

By your own words, you are telling us you are not tolerant yourself. If other people don’t want to integrate (or worst still, want to hurt those who live differently to them) then replicating that behaviour (as the far right do) is compounding the situation, and the cycle of hatred continues. Surely we all should have one common enemy, that is extremism, whatever the motives and whatever side of the divide these people are on.

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there is always extremism, or communism, i don't want to live in your world where everyone is the same thanks

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So you want to live in a world where people kill other people because they think differently to how they think?

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no, i'd prefer they settled it over a game of conkers, but if thats the price to pay to avoid the grey homogenised sterility of the alternative then so be it

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Yes, these innocent people being murdered really does brighten up an otherwise dull day eh?

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Evidently

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edited 22/06, 20:45 788 views

Great post. The only area I would differ from you is where you say 'no not all Muslims interpret their religion this way.. but there is clearly something that draws many many thousands to do so.'.. I would say world wide it runs into the millions.

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Based on what?

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I'm not fixating on anything, I'm pointing out hypocrisy and the reality that's becoming more apparent that it seems some on the right can only focus on one issue at a time, that seems to be the difference here. The right criticise the Muslim community for not addressing extremism within their midst, whilst ignoring it within their own and failing to realise how certain rhetoric is breeding further intolerance and playing into the hands of those who hate the west.

There is a link between many recent terrorist attacks and I have not and will never pretend there isn't. What I do acknowledge is that as with any ideology and movement, there are numerous reasons as to how they spring up and then spread. As I keep saying, it's not black and white.

edited 20/06, 16:14 764 views

"the right can only focus on one issue at a time" ?

you really are a dangerous little individual with your blinkered views, quite extreme in a way, worth monitoring for sure

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Way to take a whole conversation out of context. So glad we've got you as the voice of reason in all this.

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its your entire modus operandi, grates doesn't it?

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Not really

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point proven

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I'm a liberal lefty. I'm all for equality and tolerance. And that's why I don't automatically dismiss all right wing people as fascists. Some right wing people ARE complete fascist thugs of course. But then again, the so called liberal left aren't without their bullies. The problem is, people don't respect facts anymore. They push their agenda without following the evidence. 'Winning' now outweighs truth. You shouldn't blindly be fighting for a side. Each ethical problem has a solution that enriches the common good. No one 'owns' virtue.

Ricky Gervais.

Seemed apt with you two

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Sounds like a load of lefty bollocks, as usual from that poof

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Poof? Don't you mean, working class lad done good? [tea]

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Sounds similarish to my original point, so I win :-D

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Kind words B. I'm just an ordinary bloke with mild addictions fumbling through, eager to see pals at Chelsea for booze n bensons where I'm at my happiest.

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Legend, that's what's you are [walts]

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